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Tech letters for April 30, 2003
Edited by John Stevenson
Confounded by carbon fiber? Need to sound off about superlight stuff? Tech letters is the forum for your gear-related questions and opinions.
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Orbea Team 03
Frame Materials
Sprocket hunt
2004 Dura-Ace
Adjustable Seats
Campagnolo goes electronic
Dura-Ace 9 speed cassette
Mavic Brake Pads
The best bike
Tough tyres
Why so much grease?
Orbea Team 03 #1
I actually own one of the sloping tube models in their Lobular tube set. It is the best Al ride I have ever been on. The extended carbon seat-post makes up for a lot of road shock. I feel like I am back on my Waterford Paramount without the weight. It almost feels like steel. Great Ride!
Thomas Licker
Moon Township, PA
Friday, April 25 2003
Orbea Team 03 #2
I own the 2002 team issue bike without the carbon back end. Apart from the carbon the spec is the same. I have the Campag Record on mine with the carbon brakes etc. It's a stunning bike. If you are a weight fetish go for the full Starship frame as it's lighter than the carbon back end though you will feel the bumps a little more.
Quality of construction is top notch, each top spec frame is built to order, if they think it will work they will build you whatever you want. For the ultimate pose get you name signwriten onto the top tube.
These bikes are not a team copy, they are team issue, built alongside the pro bikes by the guys making the pro bikes. Sometimes better; the pros do not choose what goes on their bikes. They are made to be ridden as fast as possible and handle like a dream no matter if you are going uphill or down dale.
Delivery should now have speeded up, mine took 8 weeks. They now have the only oven for heat treating starship tubing outside Italy. Because of the team colours the bike will get noticed so only get the shorts and shirts if you have the legs to match the complete pro pose.
A top notch bike from one of the fast rising frame builders. Marks out of 10? Without question, 10.
'ZARHEL'
Monday, April 28 2003
Frame Materials
Question: Is aluminum the tubing of choice for pro team bikes since it's a cost effective material to build a bike that is only expected to last one season?
I ask this since I've been advised by some knowledgeable builders to stay away from aluminum if I want a durable frame. As a strong rider who is 175lb and not inclined to buy a new frame every season, titanium, steel, or carbon is the better material?
Can of worms: I can understand how it's in the business interests of the bike companies to build light frames that will need to be replaced in a few years. And hey, "the pros ride them..."
Noel Murphy
Mill Valley, CA
Friday, April 25 2003
I think this is too cynical. Aluminium's a nice material for bike frames because it's fairly easy to build a light frame from it, and its wide use in lots of applications means its properties are well understood when it coes to things like welding and heat-treating. And I know big riders who love their aluminium frames because they're light and stiff, which is a hard trick in a big frame for many materials.
There are good and bad frames in aluminium, just as there are in all materials - it's not the material, but what the designer and builder does with it that counts. - JS
Sprocket hunt
I am looking for a 21-23 sprocket Dura-ace to put on the bike I bought from Robbie McEwen which came with a 11-21. Any ideas? I can only find whole cassettes.
Alan Morris
Australia
Sunday, April 27 2003
Shimano Australia's G-Matt, the Man Who Knows when it comes to Shimano spares, tells us that replacement sprockets for the Dura-Ace cluster do exist and are in stock. However, the largest sprockets of the Dura-Ace cluster are titanium, and therefore cost almost as much as the whole cluster. The three largest sprockets are riveted to their own aluminium carrier, so you have to replace all three, and the shift between the existing sprockets and the new ones may not be perfect as the Hyperglide shift gates might not line up properly.
Matt suggests, and we tend to agree with his, that the hassle factor is not worth it, and if cost is an issue a simpler solution is to fit a CS-6500 cluster instead. - JS
2004 Dura-Ace #1
The biggest change since 7 to 8 to 9 speed and STI, and all these changes to this kit in one model year. I love the crankset and the ten speed will come in handy, also the low profile levers. Hopefully Santa will bring it.
Scott Johnson
Tuesday, April 29 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #2
Shame the new Dura Ace Crankset is so butt ugly. I much prefer Campy shifter/brakes to the Shimano brifters, but Shimano rear D's seem to shift much sweeter than their Campy counterparts (and the barrel adjuster is easier to use). So the (inevitable) question is: will you be able to run a new 10 speed Dura Ace rear derailleur with a Record or Chorus 10 speed Ergo shifter?
Brendan Moylan
Tuesday, April 29 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #3
I know this has nothing to do with the function of the 2004 Dura Ace, but the position of the new levers on LA's bike looks like a rookie job. The one thing I have always liked about a Campy set up is its clean lines and the way the hoods almost make a straight line off the bar. Now the new Shimano pronounces the difference between the bar and the hood. The derailleur wire that sticks out the side of the shifter has never been a fave of mine either. Now it is even higher in front of the bar.
I started my cycling career when SunTour still made some of the finer components you could buy, and I thought the invention of the dual brake/shift lever was one of the smartest things I had ever seen. But Campy did it one better by hiding all the cables.
As for the rest of the Dura-Ace group, it all looks fantastic, and I am sure works remarkably well. Not sure the crank looks like a road crank, but it still looks very cool, and I gotta believe works very well indeed.
I saw the list of teams that are waiting for the new gear, Rabbobank has Campy now?, and I wonder if you could tell us if there are any teams switching to the new Shimano?
Adam YoDvD
Springfield, MO
Tuesday, April 29 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #4
The cranks look like there's a lot more material. Curious what the weight is? Has anyone heard?
Tim Woolford
USA
Tuesday, April 29 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #5
Nice if you can afford it. Still if I make the switch to 10-speed it will be Campy.
Sean Scott
Canada
Tuesday, April 29 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #6
This is, of course, just a guess, but a current RD-7700 will probably not work with 10-speed, as speculated. If Shimano does the same thing they did in going from 8 to 9 speed with the RD-7700, routing the cable over (rather than under) the anchor bolt of the RD-7800 is what would make it compatible with 9-speed, with the cable travel at the lever - per click - remaining unchanged from 9 or 8-speed.
Chris Reimer
Wares Cycles
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
Tuesday, April 29 2003
Maybe, but that change was made also to bring the pull-ratio of the Dura-Ace rear derailleur into line with the rest of the Shimano range, as it had long been incompatible. For ten-speed, I'm guessing the cable pull-per-click at the lever will be slightly less, otherwise the new rear derailleur won't work with nine-speed shifters and sprockets, and Shimano says it will.
I guess we'll know for sure when Shimano lets us actually ride and tinker with this stuff. - JS
2004 Dura-Ace #7
I think the new chainset is butt-ugly! Stiffer and lighter is all very well, but does style need to be scrapped along the way?
Oli Brooke-White
Wellington, New Zealand
Wednesday, April 30 2003
2004 Dura-Ace #8
All looks great, except one thing. What the heck is attached to that sweet looking crank, a polished up gear from a racing cart (it can't be from an F1 ride or it would be carbon)? The big 'S' has got some work to do to that fly wheel of a chain ring. But then again I'm not an engineer, so maybe they need all the aluminum to carry the new "light weight" 10 speed chain. Well if all else fails I can keep the bike in the car, and if I have transmission trouble on the way to the local "I work full time, own a house, and have three kids so shut up about my fitness" weekly criterium I can still get there by jerry rigging this thing in the tranny.
In the end, I write the check and love every bit of it.
Gordon Cumming
USA
Tuesday, April 29 2003
Adjustable Seats #1
Another sound option is to switch seatposts. I think this is better because you won't have to re-acquaint your "soft spot" with a new saddle. The Look Ergopost (http://www.lookcyclesusa.com/ac-ergo_post.htm) is a great post that I have used for years. They have two different models now and both have a 25mm of fore and aft adjustment. That, in conjunction with the adjustment on the rails of your saddle, should be adequate for your current bike. Of course a new custom bike is always the ideal fitting scenario.
Brandon Emkes
Indianapolis, IN, USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Adjustable Seats #2
Seatposts such as Selcof Biposition, Look Ergo Post and Profile Fastforward (mounted backward) may offer a solution.
Eric Schulte
Netherlands
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Adjustable Seats #3
Have you looked at Easton seatposts? They have huge amounts of setback. Check out the EA70 or the EC70.
Bill Kallas
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Adjustable Seats #4
Beware of riding with your San Marco all the way back on the rails. I busted a Ti rail on my San Marco (original equipment on my Trek 5200) riding with it all the way back in the clamp. It snapped clean through right at the clamp. I replaced it with an Aspide (also San Marco) which I mounted 1/2 inch further forward. The bike (and saddle) only had about 6,000 miles (9,700km) on them when the rail broke.
Duncan M. Granger
Lancaster, PA USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Adjustable Seats #5
Try a Look or Specialized seat post. Either allows much more than a normal amount of set back.
Mark Caldwell
California, USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Adjustable Seats #6
One possible solution: a CLB seatpost with lots of setback. They can be purchased at Wallingford Bicycle. See http://www.wallbike.com/seatposts/clb.html
Ron Clark
Thursday, April 24 2003
Adjustable Seats #7
I think that most seats will have roughly the same fore and aft adjustment and your seatpost if among the most 'laid back' on the market, assuming that you have the Ritchey model I'm thinking of. The best, albeit expensive, option may be the Look ergo seatpost which allows for a lot of adjustment. Cheaper than a larger frame anyhow!
Arwel Davies
UK
Friday, April 25 2003
Campagnolo goes electronic #1
Even if everything worked flawlwssly, what is the point?
Mechanical: you have to press a lever to shift
Electric: you still have to push something to shift, it's not like it's automatic.
Not to mention, when it gets cold, the battery WILL crap out on you, and you'll be left gearless. Also, I can't imagine this being anywhere as reliable as the good ol' cable system we have now.
Rob Bander
British Columbia, Canada
Monday, April 28 2003
Campagnolo goes electronic #2
A number of good points have been made about Campy's new group, both good and bad. But I have to wonder why Campy has decided on an electronic front derailleur. It makes no sense, and looks awful. At least the rear battery is well integrated into the whole system. And perhaps they will provide remote shifter controls for use on time trial bars, as that would be a good use for the rear. It still seems unnecessary for the front.
But perhaps Campy is going somewhere else with this. It seems to have been missed that this gruppo weighs the same as current Record, even with the batteries. Put all the weight saving bits they used on this into a mechanical Record group, and you have a seriously light setup.
Chris Fabri
USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Dura-Ace 9 speed cassette #1
My Dura-Ace 9 speed cassette snapped the mounting lugs (aluminium/cast) that hold the titanium sprockets in place, which was weird in itself. So anyhow I looked at getting a replacement and couldn't bring myself to pay the $200 odd bucks for the Dura-Ace version, so I bought a 105 cassette at half the price! Works great, you don't even notice the weight difference, and it hasn't snapped so far. It works flawlessly with the rest of the Dura-Ace running gear, so I would go for the cheaper option if I were you!
Stuart Harmer
Australia
Thursday, April 24 2003
Dura-Ace 9 speed cassette #2
I think the titanium sprockets wear out way too fast. You usually discover that they're wearing out in the middle of race when you're climbing and looking for a lower gear, you shift and find the chain skipping and making all sorts of noises. It's not worth it.
Jim Cushing-murray
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Dura-Ace 9 speed cassette #3
The titanium rings on the Dura-Ace cluster do not seem to have any problems with wear. I am a 90 kilogram rider who has been riding a full Dura-Ace system for four years and am only just about to replace the drive train.
'jge18'
Canturbury new Zealand
Monday, April 28 2003
Mavic Brake Pads
Shimano pads or any designed to fit Shimano (Kool Stop, etc.) will fit fine.
Doug Hall
USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #1
All I have to say on this subject is that I believe there are maybe a dozen top end bikes in that price range that are more or less the same. Some will have features suited to one rider over another, but really the difference is minute. It is however, amazing how many people like Trek, simply because they are a Tour winner, when in reality, if you put Lance on any one of a dozen bikes, he would still win.
Tim Lee
Australia
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #2
The first thing you need to do is ask your self "what kind of rider am I?" Are you a recreational weekend rider, or a wanna-be racer, or a soon to be racer? (And the list goes on). You said you have been riding for a short time. A 5900 is a whole lot of bike; more bike than probably 95 percent of riders will ever need. But a wise man once said, buy the best bike you can afford. Since all brands utilize slightly different geometries, why is your heart set on a Trek? (I say this and I own a Trek). Are you aware of the differences between, say, a compact frame like a Giant TCR and slacker frame like a LeMond? If not, you should do some research, and more important, set aside a day or two and test ride at least three bikes in your price range.
As far as saddles go, it's personal preference. A good bike shop will not only take the time to fit you, but might let you "try" different saddles free of charge. (If you drop five-large, they had better at least do that). Take your time and you will find a bike that will feels like your favorite pair of shoes.
Mike Henry
Tucson AZ USA
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #3
I guess part of it also depends on how much you are willing to spend. I own a 59cm Colnago C-40 with Shimano Dura-Ace components (I know, I know, Shimano on an Italian frame, scandalous!) and stock Colnago Excellence wheels. I love the feel of the C-40 over rough roads - no wonder it does so well at Paris-Roubaix! The C-40 really dampens rough pavement and accelerates better than any of my other bikes. I like Shimano over Campy simply because I like the feel of the STI levers over Campy's. The thumb lever on Campy's shifter is too uncomfortable for me to get at and the hoods are too narrow for me.
As for a saddle, I've ridden on Flite Ti, Serfas, and Hoskar, but I love the Selle Italia TurboMatic IV. It's not the lightest saddle but for ride comfort and durability, I don't think you can beat it.
If you're willing to go off the deep end like I did, the Colnago is tops. Happy hunting!
Jonathan A Lested
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #4
Sounds like you need some serious saddle time, bro. As you mature as a cyclist, you will find out what is "best" for you. The bicycle is as individual as the people that ride it. It is infinitely customizable. One of the great beauties of our sport. Get a top-quality bike that fits, and then go from there.
Colin Williams
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #5
Hopefully you are looking at the Trek because you have heard good things about it, not because Lance has won four Tours on it. He could have done that on anybody else's bike. Most people agree that great bikes that are high-production (read high performance for the money) are Cannondale, Litespeed, LeMond, and Trek. They will give you a great race feel and reliability. Remember though, try bikes if you can. Most of the time one will make you say "ooh! Something about this on feels great!" And you know what? It doesn't matter what makes it feel great- that bike was just made for you.
Christopher Wentz
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #6
www.vanillabicycles.com
Lyman White
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #7
A Pinarello is what you need. Get the Dogma, Campagnolo Record 10, Hyperon wheels, Cinelli Ram Bars/Stem, Time pedals and Fizik saddle. Or, alternatively, same components and wheels, but consider the Fondriest TF1, Colnago C40 HP, Pinarello Prince SL, DeRosa King... and other high end Italian mounts. Of course, best thing is to get a custom made bike from one of these makers. Forget American bikes for the ultimate high end rides.
Raj
Singapore
Thursday, April 24 2003
The best road bike #8
I recently sat on a few seats at my LBS and ended up buying a Selle San Marco Aspide. It's lighter than most, but still very comfortable for long rides, I've been on it for rides of 3 - 4 hours and more with no problems.
If you really want the best possible road bike, that Aspide should be on top of an Easton EC90 seatpost, which should in turn be stuck into a Cannondale CAAD 7 frame. I'd opt for Cinelli's RAM integrated bar and stem, and Record drivetrain, aside from the Cannondale Hollowgram cranks and bottom bracket. I'd also have Mavic brakes and wheels - Ksyrium SLs. If money is totally inconsequential and you only ride on roads that are smooth as glass, (and aren't afraid of tubulars), then a set of Hyperions or the new Boras would be a better choice for wheels. How 'bout Speedplay X1s for pedals?
Rob Roeder
USA
Thursday, April 24 2003
The best road bike #9
As far as the best road bike goes here would be my criteria, not in any particular order (after fit, dealer support, etc.)
1. Looks and paintjob - is it a beautiful work of art? can you see the craftsmanship?
does the style match your age/team colours/etc?
2. Brand - is it a name that sets people (and most importantly you) on fire?
Do you desire technical leadership or quiet, unassuming superiority?
3. Racing pedigree or heritage - did Merckx ride one? Does Lance ride one?
4. Functionality - do you need the stiffness of aluminium? The compliance of
titanium?
I recently went through this thought process to buy my dream bike and opted for a Colnago C40 in the GEO colour scheme. I put Campag record 10 speed on it for some of the same reasons. Make sure you get everything you want on the right bike and don't cut corners. My bike gives me pleasure every time I see it in the garage and every time I get on it because I know it is the ultimate for me. If you'd like a specific comment on the Trek (just my opinion) - I think it is not a good looking bike, it's made of carbon fibre so has some technical leadership, it probably rides quite nicely (although I have read some 'dead' feeling stories), Lance has got one. I'd say that last point isn't always good as you may think, people down the shopping mall may recognise the name and be impressed, but a fine Italian frame, for example, has a far more impressive pedigree to me, and maybe to most other semi-serious cyclists - and eventually someone else will start winning the Tour before you stop riding your bike!
Allen Huish
UK
Thursday, April 24 2003
The best road bike #10
Ultimate road bike? How deep is your pocket? Comfort is foremost. Personally, I just bought a De Rosa King with all Campagnolo, and Deda Newton stem and bars, and was absolutely astounded by the quality of the ride and the comfort of the bike. It is the stiffest bike I have owned for the purpose of putting the power down, but also offers a ride that smooths road harshness, a very different experience from the aluminium bikes I have owned in the past. But, it was certainly not cheap. As with cars, it all depends on how much you are willing to spend. Talk to a good bike shop - not a chain, but a privately owned shop. Don't buy a bike sitting on the sales floor. Choose a frame based on your size, weight, riding style, etc., with the advice of the store owner, and have it built to your specific measurements and needs.
James K. Weaver
Thursday, April 24 2003
The best road bike #11
Check out anvilbikes.com. Don Ferris is an expert builder who will give you exactly what you need and will be 100 percent honest with you. If you want something that is a waste of money he will tell you. If you still want it, however, he will build it for you because he wants you to be happy with your bike. I will never go anywhere else for my frames. His prices are amazingly reasonable for custom, too, whether your dream ride is steel (got 2 sub 18lb[complete] super stiff Dedacciai steel bikes [road and TT] that I race my 200lbs), Al or Ti, he can build it for you. Anvils really are the best of both worlds - inexpensive AND strong/durable/perfectly fitted.
Rob Coapman
Tuesday, April 29 2003
The best road bike #12
Colnago C-40 is the ultimate ride. The bike's an extreme combination of vertical compliance and lateral rigidity plus lively springy feel. Also, its weight is 2.25 lb and C-40s are well known never to break. Ride a C-40 back to back with any material bike and it will impress. The only bike that will come close would be one of the pro quality titanium frames although they'll be almost a pound heavier, it'll be noticeable too. The overall impression of C-40 is Comfort, rigidity, lively ride with pro race geometry-which means: fast manners, but very stable in all situations. Almost too good in all areas of frame criteria.
The Icing on the cake is the most innovative and imitated airbrush artists in the world. All frames will be unique works of art.
Ferrari Formula One fabricates all of the tubes, lugs, and the monocoque carbon fork. C-40's never break, because Ferrari is Aerospace and Formula One technology. No bike can compare in a back to back comparison. Test others against it.
A good race shop will have built up frames to test ride in some sizes. C-40 would take Campy Record or Dura Ace, Ksyrium SLs good for reliable racing or training.
Robby Tatum
Wednesday, April 23 2003
The best road bike #13
If comfort is a significant issue but you still want reasonable speed and lightness, Titanium is the only way to go. Any very stiff bike, no matter what its made from is going to be fatiguing over rough roads. I've ridden steel, carbon, titanium and aluminium and my empirical experience tends to bear this out.
Ned Costello
Ireland
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Tough tyres #1
It would be interesting to know if most of the flats were on clinchers or tubulars. Tubulars are not prone to pinch flats and some tubulars are tubeless. Tufo also makes tubeless clinchers, cyclocross tires and now mountain bike tires so pinch flats are impossible.
Jim Cushing-murray
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Tough tyres #2
Specialized Armadillos are great for winter training on bad roads, but they are a bit too heavy for racing. You really notice it when you switch from your training wheels back to your fast race wheels.
Johnny Moran
Ravens CRT, Dublin, Ireland
Friday, April 25 2003
Why so much grease? #1
A heavy grease or oil bath is often used when race conditions are wet and sloppy. In these conditions an "ordinary" chain lube would not survive a 200-300 kilometer race. Imagine Johan Museeuw stopping 220k into P-R to relube his chain? While a heavy grease will eventually pick-up dirt and grime and cause drivetrain wear, a professional racer has an unlimited supply of cogsets and chains at his/her team's disposal, not to mention an overworked team mechanic to clean the whole mess up!
Paolo Markson
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Why so much grease? #2
Bikes in the pro peloton must function for 200+ kilometers each day. A few drops of "teflon" or "dry lube" won't last the distance. I believe most of the pro team wrenches are still using oil, either petroleum or synthetic-based.
Factor in a wet race and this becomes even more important. I've watched more than once as the chains have been lubed with a grease gun!
Since pro bikes get washed and serviced at the end of every stage, nobody cares much about the "cleanliness" that's such a feature of consumer chainlube advertising.
The objective is to have the chain function properly throughout the race and having it well lubricated at the start is key.
Larry Theobald
CycleItalia
Wednesday, April 23 2003
Why so much grease? #3
If there is a chance of rain on the day of a classic it is common practice for euro mechanics to slather the chains of all team bikes with grease by putting a glob of it in their hand and running the chain through it. Modern synthetic lubes have probably rendered this practice overkill but the practice has been handed down from their mentors and they continue the practice.
Jim O'Brien
Tuesday, April 29 2003
